23. Jan, 2012 
39 Comments
Quick one. Want to share something that made me once again see that I do what I do for a reason 
Got a great email. Read below:
I went digging around to find the blog post that Mike was referring to and I finally found it. It’s pasted below. NOTE: It’s literally like 2 different people.
Amazing!! Just wanted to share.
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I’d like to email this guy, guy, if you still read this blog, I want to email you
I think he is right because I’m facing the same situation . maybe other men don’t maybe we miss something i don’t know.
If you look at the FACTS in the angry missive, Mike is right. Us men are “shallow” too and so are women. Too many people look more at the anger than the FACTS and start on this ra-ra “change your inner game” stuff , which is of course not entire nonsense, but misses the main point by a million miles.
I’m not an angry person but I’m all too aware. With LOOKS and the resulting confidence gained through experience, you don’t require such efforts to “improve your inner game”, etc. Football analogy again (or soccer if you’re American) but I’ve played and coached the game for ages. When I’ve got kids that have the skills, then I don’t need to really have a system to get good performances and winning results, we just play what Johan Cruyff designated as “total football”. However, when I’ve got a less skilled group, the only way to have any chance of success is to employ systems and tactics which allow us to overachieve and there is, of course, less margin for error, if we are to succeed in our goals.
Like you said, Marni, it will all fall into place. It hurts and is scary at first, but the first step and the steps after that make you reflect and shape you. And oh I’ve been getting random smiles and hellos (interested looks) for no reason other than being me from all kinds of women.
Glad to hear it Michael
More development to come of course, but it is all at MY PACE.
Also, I’m curious Marni, what it is you actually did here? He says you helped, but I’m not sure how. I guess this is more a question for him.
He said he didn’t go with the high priced option you presented. Im also guessing I know who that high-priced option is.
$1400 fee?
It looks to me like Mike opened his mind to what was possible. He had spent years telling himself success with women depended on what he looked like and that assumption ran on automatic. We see what we look for and validate our assumptions.
The first dating coaches I followed offered a step-by-step plan, and the very first assignment was to start noticing hot women with dweebs on their arms. It didn’t take long at all to notice. It was a good first assignment because right away it got me asking the question, “What does she see in HIM that she doesn’t see in ME? It MUST be something other than what he looks like.” And my mind was open.
$1400 fee? SHUDDER!!
I’m in two minds about this subject but the football analogy doesn’t work in this context. Those “kids who have the skills” were not born with those skills. They had to learn and develop them and they did that through systems such as practising repeatedly and learning from more skilled players. Plus, regardless of the skill of your players, you’re going to be employing some kind of system in your football games in order to get the best results. World class players in the Premier League follow systems given to them by their managers.
Chelsea and Liverpool FC did not wait for people to be born with football skills. They set up academies which train players according to certain systems and ideas about the game. “Total football” is not an absence of systems. It’s what happens when those systems combine with the skills of the players at an unconscious level.
I do fear that my looks hamper me with women. But then again women have been known to actually tell me they think I’m good looking. Which doesn’t make any sense to me. I’ve seen “good looking” guys get turned down and heard about them being ignored and stood up even when they got the phone number off the girl. I think it’s a lot more complicated then we sometimes realise. People are, after all, variables.
I am puzzled as to where this idea that confidence comes from being told you’re good looking comes from. Huge swathes of good looking, attractive women don’t realise how attractive they are. Same with men. It’s beyond stupid to see a guy, think he’s good looking and assume he knows it and is confident because of it. But this seems to be what we do in society these days. We don’t concentrate on fully expressing the best of ourselves. No, instead we focus on trying to prove that other people somehow have constant advantages over us. Some do this to justify their anger at the world. Others do it to protect limiting beliefs. All I know is our light shines in unison with the lights of others not in competition with the lights of others.
“Huge swathes of good looking, attractive women don’t realise how attractive they are. Same with men. It’s beyond stupid to see a guy, think he’s good looking and assume he knows it and is confident because of it.”
No, actually it’s not.
These swathes of good looking people that “dont realise” how attractive they are, actually do realise how attractive they are, they just downplay it’s importance, which of course is easy to do when you have that particular trait.
Back in their minds, they KNOW they are attractive,
I do this with things I am good at, I was awesome in martial arts, kicked f*cking ass, learned techniques with relative ease, while others had to struggle. People would say Im good all the time, I’d just be humble about it. but I knew I was good. I just wanted to be better and better and would downplay how good I was.
But I knew I was better than 90% of my club.
So it’s not beyond stupid to assume that attractive women and men are confident in knowing they are better looking than the avg if they’re being told it repeatedly. It’s just a fact.
Now they might downplay it’s importance, I mean Halle Berry was quoted as saying something like, “my life hasn’t been easier even being someone that people consider attractive” Hello? let her live as a 400 lb trailer park woman for a week and the come back with “my life hasn’t been easier”
The people who are attractive have to IGNORE A LOT MORE to not be confident.
Nice post Marty, I especially like that last paragraph.
Some people act like prisoners in a cell, constantly bemoaning that they are trapped. The most depressing thing is you can throw open the cell door and declare they are free and yet they will refuse to leave.
“The most depressing thing is you can throw open the cell door and declare they are free and yet they will refuse to leave.”
The equivalent of that, to me is 10 playboy models coming to my door and saying, “oh hey skw we were just passing by and wanted to have sex with you repeatedly for the next 72 hours, is that alright with you?”
If that happened, I wouldn’t argue away saying how rough and tough I’ve had it.
“and the very first assignment was to start noticing hot women with dweebs on their arms. It didn’t take long at all to notice.”
Hmm.. I found this to be the opposite. I saw very very few instances of hot women with “dweebs” on their arms.
I *DID* see a few, no doubt, but they were the exception to the rule by far. Plus it could have been money as well, there’s no way of knowing how much the guy was worth. Especially in NYC its not uncommon for some guys to be worth more than half a million.
What I started doing – and it really helped, was looking at hot women directly in the eye, even if for a second, and seeing imperfections in their body and face, and realizing, although they are in a privileged position, they aren’t perfect. There was a woman in the gym with the nicest, biggest tits I ever saw, but her nose was oddly shaped, and she had a few pimples… so I focused on that.
I started going to strip clubs also, not to get lap dances, rather to have women approach me, and try and “charm me” (of course I know they’re only interested in the money and not me) but I thought this might have me better understand women, who regularly get guys approaching them for their bodies rather than their personalities..
…also it gave me an ego boost to continuously reject them – another insight into women that get to sit back and just reject all day long. and hells mother fucking yes, that shit felt good.
skw,
Hardly a day goes by when I don’t want to pick up my ball and go home and some point. But I’ve done that too many times in the past, and it only feels good for a moment.
AT some point
Skw – interesting yes and I do believe in that Lindsey Lohan line “just because I don’t fancy someone doesn’t mean I don’t want them to fancy me”. So true.
The only problem with seeing their IMPERFECTIONS is you also see YOURS – I know because I’m still in that place myself. Also, don’t you notice that the women who are self-critical on their appearance are almost always the ones that want the hottest man possible? A self-critical person is almost always critical of others, both you and me fall in that category ourselves. Not that I want to encourage your ranting, because, despite being right, you really ought to get up and do something about it… and I know you are going to the gym, so keep that up…
i dont see how this is “ranting”
just because I don’t fall over myself saying how great this stuff is, and how great Marni is (I appreciate what she does – but much of what she and others say doesn’t stand up to basic logical inquiry)
I go to the gym, I attend a dance class in break and toprock, stuff like this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Spaa7shbkrA
although I’m not that good yet.
I also quit my job last year to pursue something Im extremely passionate about. In fact so passionate I’d rather be making my way in that field than f*cking around with dumb chicks anyway. Unfortunately , my d*ck gets hard when I see these women, so I keep coming back thinking just with enough ‘self confidence” I can make it happen.
So have you actually worked with Marni? Or are you just arguing with what you read here? If you’ve given her the benefit of the doubt and she has failed you, I want to know about it before I invest in sessions with her. (Of course, I will also take the positive testimonies into account.)
Drop your email and I’ll send you a response to your question.
That’s OK.
“The only problem with seeing their IMPERFECTIONS is you also see YOURS –”
Well, mine are readily apparent, I see mine anyway, I’m not good looking, don’t have a lot of money, and also loathe most things that girls value (like buying roses and paying for dates and shit like that)
This is a really heart warming story. I’m really happy for this guy!
I can relate to his story a lot. I’ve also found that when you start to get it figured out with attraction and these wonderful things start happening to you it’s almost like you don’t know how to cope with it and you need to escape to the safety of the familiar. Just have to get used to hot women wanting you.
Hats off to him though. Well done!
Sounds like there was a tipping point for you. I hope I’m close to it myself.
The tipping point is when you stop making excuses for yourself and take responsibility for what happens in your life, which it sounds like you’ve already done.
The rest is just a steady ramp of things getting better, punctuated by “aha!” moments. It will start slow, but keep at it
I’ve worked with Marni and yes she knows what she’s talking about.
I’ve had more “a-ha” moments in the last couple of days just listening to an audio of Marni coaching than I have in a long time. Taking responsibility without excuses has been something I have to do over and over and over and over and over and over and over again, however. But “a-ha” moments in the past have tipped over into things becoming automatic that previously required large amounts of effort.
I enjoyed your comments.
They do if you keep at it, and it means you’re on to the next challenge. I firmly believe that if you have the courage to keep stepping just beyond your comfort zone amazing results are inevitable given time.
Awesome mate.
What if a person has taken responsibility for those elements that he was actually responsible for, but the fact still remains that there were factors beyond his control that clearly affected how and why he’s in that situation?
Isn’t that just a clear acknowledgement of facts?
“I’ve worked with Marni and yes she knows what she’s talking about.”
Care to elaborate?
A few things to comment on, we are going around in circles on certain things – to simplify the looks thing, looks matter, look your best and you should (and this includes skw) get into the top 35-40% with real dedication. Yes, certain people not genetically blessed have to work way harder to do it, yes its unfair, yes it pisses me off that I wasn’t born in the top 0.1%. And no I’m not going to be another one to “quit on skw” and tell him to “sort ot out”, I can totally understand where he is coming from.
That said, some interesting points made. Skw, the bboy dancing thing seems a good move, this is one of these areas that females love. Even if the dancers are not always so hot looking, it seems girls love the whole performing thing and think they are so ultra-cool to be the girlfriend of one of these dudes.
Marty Drury, some very interesting points about the football analogy but I still think there has to be a certain level of natural skills to reach that “total football” stage. I mean, seriously, not everyone can be like Messi, Iniesta or Bale for example no matter how much experience, practise, hard work and good coaching they get. I’ve played since I was 4 years old, spent countless hours practising individually and with teams, travelled the world for tournaments and football camps and received excellent coaching and my “career” ended up as half a season at Hayes United plus 6 caps in the Cheltenham reserve squad to show for it LOL.
As for looks and worrying about “others being better” I believe you are correct. We underestimate that different people have different tastes, so in this sense for over 90% of normal human beings, a 30% strike rate is a great result. HOWEVER, there is that small amount of NATURALLY HOT people, both male and female, who can pretty much have what they want on tap. And the rest of us (again not gender-specific) of course cow-tow to these “physical celebrities” and will give up our bodies for them as if we’ve hit the jackpot. This, I believe, is simply the laws of biology in action. And we are hypocrites, in my opinion, for a) not admitting to this urge to be with “the HOT” and b) expecting “the rest” to do more to earn the right to be with us, whether that be a kiss, sex or a relationship.
“Skw, the bboy dancing thing seems a good move, this is one of these areas that females love”
I don’t give two fucks whether females love it or not. It’s spiritual for me, and I do it because I enjoy it, girls can go #)$(@ themselves , when it comes to bboying, the shit is real truth.
btw, none of that anger was directed to you. you’re one of the more sensible people around here.
LOL no offense taken; supposedly not giving two f¤%&s about whether females love it or not is an ATTRACTIVE quality haha… though I’m not so sure of that myself
hasn’t yielded anything yet.
so that whole concept of women being attracted to men who do something because they love it, you believe, is just a way of them really saying “hes hot but I want to sound less shallow so Ill word it in this way”…. Ive often thought that kind of thing happens a lot myself…
So you’re saying women only like physically attractive men that do something because they love it?
Pretty much sees that way at times, I think the two things combined create attraction….
wow, in his 40′s and still single? never had a girlfriend, this is what i’ve noticed, the list of things that turn women off is insanely, way longer than the list of things that turn men off
To answer SKW’s point:
An attractive person could have had any kind of upbringing. Any kind of feedback from people. They might even have self esteem, confidence problems or BDD. They could have come from a broken home or been abused. Anything could have gone on in the life of that person to influence how they see themselves.
Assuming that an attractive person knows they are attractive because they’ve obviously had great feedback all their life is flawed thinking. It’s an attempt at mind reading who a person is.
If all attractive people knew they were attractive then you’d never get an attractive person with BDD or self esteem issues or confidence issues. They’d all just be able to rely on the knowledge that they’re attractive. But that’s not what happens. You get many people with BDD who are attractive. Why? Because people can and do develop massively distorted ideas about how they look.
It’s not hard in this day and age for people to develop distorted views about how they look or how they should look. Attractive people the world over develop distorted ideas about how they look and compare themselves unfavourably to other people. Those are the facts.
It’s not a fact to assume that an attractive person knows they’re attractive. It’s a guess. And it’s not a very good guess either.
Now, there may be some attractive people who do know that they are attractive. You’d find that out when you got to know them. But to assume that that’s the case right off the bat would be highly illogical given that every person is an individual with unique life experiences and none of us are mind readers.
If I think a girl is hot that doesn’t mean the girl thinks she’s hot. I don’t know how she feels about herself until I talk to her and get to know her.
Mind reading other people is a dangerous activity. It’s like the guy who sees a hot girl at the bar but won’t approach her because he mind reads her and assumes she knows she’s hot and won’t want to speak to a guy like him.
In reality, she’s a friendly girl who doesn’t realise how attractive she is. But thanks to the mind read, the guy’s not going over there to talk to her.
Hey Marty
I think you’ve raised a great point here: I’ve known loads of women who are so beautiful, yet don’t know it! So when a guy doesn’t approach them they feel even less attractive: when the reality is that the guy has often made a judgement call that because the woman is so attractive that she won’t be receptive to his approach.
So the most important thing is to try not to make a hasty judgement, if you want to go say hi- go for it!
Marni